Still having trouble figuring out this one.

I get how and why it increases the drive but I'm still having trouble with a few of the "basic" rules I was taught.

Issue 1) I thought we teach the dog that all of the toys are MINE. If we bring out resource guarding aren't we essentially saying "This is mine, but if you growl or guard it then you can keep it?" Doesn't this contradict the ownership of the toy rule?

Issue 2) Out. If the dog learns he can defend his toy does this make teaching out harder? I can see a reply of "If you do it right then you won't have issues" coming along but can someone detail the correct way to do this?

Thanks in advance!

Remember we are discussing the training and conditioning of a working dog, not a pet.

We are discussing resource guarding from "other people", outside the dogs perceived pack. A working law enforcement dog should see itself as more confident and assertive than members outside its pack. It should always receive drive satisfaction with a win. We are not discussing guarding resources from you the owner of the dog.

For a working law enforcement dog, and remember these discussions are for developing working ability in a dog, not your average pet at home.

I feel in many dogs, if the dog learns to out to easily, then it has not reached drive intensity. For a working law enforcement dog for example we want drive intensity, not focus on waiting for an out. So yes the out is not easily trained into such a dog.

But we can teach the out in drive training having the pup release a tug on command, staying in drive then reinitiating the bite with a quick movement of the tug, then a win.

We can start this conditioning at a young age, making it all a game. Eventually due to repetition, it becomes a subconcious response in the dog. In sport dog such as Schutzhund, we are not developing high defence, resource guarding or fight drive.

However when building on defence and fight drive in an older dog for law enforcement, focus to win the challange becomes a lot stronger, and therefore the out harder to achieve.

Maybe others here have different opnions, I'd love to get an all round view on this subject. We can never stop learning

__________________
Mark Singer
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I agree Mark.

I tend to teach the “out” very early so there is little conflict between us when the pup matures and starts doing bitework. I teach it when the pup has anything I want, or even when presenting a retrieved article so that the pup/dog understands that he releases when I say the word, but he may or may not get the item back straightaway so that it knows that I’m not depriving it from him/her forever. This is all part of the game, and the word is the same for everything I want the pup to release and this carries through to bitework. However we all know that when a mature dog is high in drive during manwork, especially when it’s real, there is a vast difference than on the training field. As you say the dog reaches extreme drive intensity with a street bite.

I have seen many dogs do a perfect “out” when “re-licensing”, in fact they all have to, to varying acceptable degrees providing it’s conducive with the licensing criteria, but this is on a training paddock; at work on the street it’s a whole new ball-game. My own thoughts are that if you can ‘out’ with little or no conflict (between you and the dog), and the ‘out’ doesn’t weight heavily and take over from the dog’s drive and actually reduce the intensity/power of the bite, that’s all you can strive for. On the street, I’d sooner be struggling to get my dog off, than witnessing a half-hearted bite because my dog is more concerned with the ‘out’ than the bite.

Cheers
Peter

Answered all my questions

This forum is great, I've probably learnt more just reading this forum than I did with the dvds I watched.