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Reply With QuoteJolanda Naarding (07-31-2011)
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DOG's NEVER PUNISH!
Thought I'd start a thread on my views on the difference (IMHO) between correction and punishment
I NEVER use the word punishment with my clients. I never tell my clients to punish their dog. I inform them to use a correction. In my opnion we should never punish unwanted behaviour, we correct it.
Punishment - Usually carried out with negative emotion
My view is that punishment is usually administered out of anger due to a loss of control. Punishment is usually administered after the fact, when the dog is less likely to understand the reasoning behind our negative behaviour toward it. For example, we come home and find the washing all over the back yard ripped to shreds. Our dog comes running up to us, happy we are home. We are angry, grab the dog and punish him in front of the ripped up washing. Not only is the dog put into a state of confusion, but in many cases fear. Due to our anger, we then prolong the punishment even after the dog has submitted to our aggression. The dog has no out from our aggressive behaviour, as submitting doesn't work. We create stress in the dog because the dog is then continually on guard watching our body language looking for signs of this aggressive energy, and runs off in fear or becomes aggressive itself to protect itself (because remember, submitting naturally didn't work).
Or we catch our dog actually in the act, and use punishment. We see our dog chewing on the tv remote. We rush over in anger and punish our dog, our dog submits to our aggression, but due to our state of mind we continue with the aggressive energy and continue to punish our dog. Again the dog has no out to our aggression, as submitting didn't work.
We end up with a dog that doesn't trust or respect our leadership. When the dog is punished..It runs off in fear or turns and displays fear aggression.
Correction (and blocking) - Carried out with no emotion
Correction is an instant reaction to correct an unwanted behaviour, while the dog is still focused on this unwanted behaviour. We correct without emotion, as there is never a sense of a loss of control. When the dog submits to our instant correction we cease the correction immediately. The dog then trusts our correction and leadership. After the correction we act as if nothing happened and continue our normal relationship with our dog. Our dog is not stressed and is never on guard looking for the negative energy as described above in punishment. A dog that is corrected properly never runs off from its owner, it actually comes to the owner as a mark of respect you could say. I then praise my dog, always, no matter what my dog was corrected for.
As Cesar Milan so rightly says "CALM assertive energy and body language"
I hate the terms used in dog training such as -P +P etc.. The term punishment presents the wrong attitude, and a wrong state of mind.
I'd be interested in other opinions.....
Jolanda Naarding (07-31-2011)
Very good Mark. l too am not in favour of all the +- P etc, confusing to ordinary folks and the word punishment seems to convey that the dog would know it was being "punished" for what it knew was "wrong" . In fact it is to release the anger of the handler most often. That is why l prefer to think of a correction as a "dont do that " message to the dog. No real emotion is needed at all, it is just advice for the dog as the action is occurring . If we seem confident, controlled and in charge, the advice will be respected, with no ill effect to the dog.
Good write up Mark, nice topic
Tony
Hi Mark
Very good topick.
I don't know if I ever use the term Punishment if I do it is not intentional. (language problem) I always use corection rather then punishment for the above reasons.
I think that corection is the wright way to do things.
Adam
Been a while since my last post but this thread caught my interest.
Good points raised by Mark and those since.....correction is ESSENTIAL despite the crap raised by some in the dog training world. It however like reward, must be administered with a purpose.
We all have been guilty at some point of letting emotion invade effective training, yet those who understand their goals acknowledge their mistake and move past it.
Dog's don't understand morals, they simply respond to behaviour markers. Whether discovered themselves or given by handlers. If you miss the window...you missed it, don't try and impose human thought on an animal. A marker occurs immediately, it is of no use 2 minutes later.
It is up to us all to ensure these behaviours are either corrected or rewarded....all in balance.
Words I don't have an issue with though.....call it correction/punishment/pressure/pain.....it is the way you control the response you direct, not the word you use to describe it.
Cameron
I use the two words interchangably as to me they mean the same thing, however, when discussing it with others I think I might start using correction as you are correct in how most people view the word punishment.
I too use the terms "correction" or "consequence" when talking to other people. Punishment seems to be a very emotive word that upsets a lot of people. While punishment can be used both kindly and subtly, and doesn't necessarily involve even laying a hand on the animal, a lot of people just seem to assume that it equates to physical abuse.
I was reading a book a while back (I think it was by Kayce Cover) that suggested the term "diminisher" as an alternative to "punisher" for use in animal training discussions. I don't think it will ever catch on (and it's not like we need even more terminology to confuse people), but thought it was an interesting suggestion. She thought that diminishment was a less emotive term than punishment, and also that it more accurately reflects what you're trying to do - when you punish you're really just trying to diminish the frequency or intensity of a behaviour.
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